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RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to Secure Wireless Networks article

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RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 12.Sep.2003 5:14:00 AM   
kmbuchanan

 

Posts: 13
Joined: 3.Sep.2003
From: Lexington, NC
Status: offline
Tom,

We "finally" got the L2TP VPN client to work - and everything is looking good with this idea. I am very impressed with this configuration. From the other vendor proposals I have seen, I like this one best.

BUT...

When we copied a file from the WLAN to the TRUSTED network, the CPU utilization went thru the roof (50-60%) - and we only have one client and one serve connected in our test config. Of course the VPN/ISA Server isn't a real work horse (P3-500 256Mb), but I question the sizing requirements for a production system.

We want to support ~50 concurrent VPN clients in the WLAN. Traffic (typically) will be comparable to 'heavy' web traffic. (no idea on actual b/w per user at this time)

What type of server would be required to support 50 L2TP VPN clients? Would a quad P2-500 Xeon 1G server handle the encrypt/decrypt workload?

Thanks!

-Kevin

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 21
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 8.Oct.2003 2:55:00 AM   
Kirill

 

Posts: 205
Joined: 26.Sep.2001
Status: offline
Here is a little guide on what I did. I used TomÆs guide as an idea and did something different [Smile]

Objectives: All wireless clients are domain members and should have the same type of access as if they were connecting from the inside of the network.

Step 1: Installed Windows 2003 server with 3 NIC cards with the following IPs: x.x.x.1 (External), y.y.y.1 (Internal), z.z.z.1 (DMZ).
Step 2: Installed ISA and included the internal network y.y.y.y to the LAT. DMZ was NOT included to the LAT.
Step 3: Used a VPN wizard ôAllow VPN client connectionsö on ISA.
Step 4: Tweaking the filters the wizard had created: Disabled all L2TP filters (wanted to use PPTP only). In PPTP filters changed from ôDefault IP addressö to the ôUse ISA serverÆs external IP addressö to ôz.z.z.1ö (DMZ).
Step 5: Created a security group called ôWireless usersö and included the users I wanted to have wireless access to this group.
Step 6: RRAS tweaking: In RRAS changed the ôPortsö so only WAN miniport (PPTP) is configured for remote access. In server properties ôSecurityö tab ôAuthentication methodsö enabled only MS-CHAP v2. Now the most important part: IP tab: Static address pool û added the set of addresses that is part of the internal network y.y.y.y; ôAdapterö-selected the one I used for DMZ. Created a remote access policy called ôWireless accessö to grant security group ôWireless usersö remote access.
Step 7: Created a VPN connectoid on a client computer to connect to the IP z.z.z.1 (DMZ) and selected ôAutomatically use my Windows log on name and passwordö in ôSecurityö. Selected PPTP. Instructed the users to log on ôUsing dial-up connectionö and select ôVPNö.

Now what have I achieved by doing it? There is only one filter on the ISA that allows the traffic from the DMZ û PPTP. No other traffic is let through. As soon as the user logs on, he gets an IP that is part of the internal network, so everything looks like heÆs connected from the inside. Domain resources are available, firewall client and web proxy work also.
No other tweaking required.

I hope it helps [Cool]

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 22
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 8.Oct.2003 3:09:00 PM   
tshinder

 

Posts: 47490
Joined: 10.Jan.2001
From: Texas
Status: offline
Hi Kirill,

Nice setup!

Thanks!
Tom

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 23
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 28.Jan.2004 4:26:00 PM   
tpagel

 

Posts: 3
Joined: 28.Jan.2004
Status: offline
Hi,

I followed the instructions kirill posted. Works perfectly... I now have 4 NICs (Internet, Intranet, DMZ, WLAN) with the WLAN outside the LAT, that's a great setup.

The only thing is that I have a DHCP running on the ISA box (for my intranet). Because WLAN useres need an IP first to connect to the ISA server, I wanted to give the NIC for the WLAN a DHCP scope, too. I don't get it running, I see an

2004-01-28 14:21:30 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 Udp 68 67 BLOCKED 192.168.201.1

in my IP Log file. So I guess the broadcast from my client to request an IP is blocked by the ISA server (192.168.201.1 is the IP of the WLAN card). I already enabled the "DHCP Client" filter, but this doesn't change anything. I guess I need a filter to enable the broadcast get through the ISA, but how?

Thomas

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 24
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 29.Jan.2004 1:00:00 AM   
tshinder

 

Posts: 47490
Joined: 10.Jan.2001
From: Texas
Status: offline
Hi Thomas,

Make sure the DHCP filter is configured to use the proper address on the DMZ interface.

HTH,
Tom

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 25
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 29.Jan.2004 11:08:00 AM   
tpagel

 

Posts: 3
Joined: 28.Jan.2004
Status: offline
Tom,

I did so... I enabled the "DHCP Client" Filter and gave it the address of the WLAN NIC.

Thanks

Thomas

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 26
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 29.Jan.2004 3:02:00 PM   
tshinder

 

Posts: 47490
Joined: 10.Jan.2001
From: Texas
Status: offline
Hi Thomas,

My bad. The DHCP client filter allows the firewall to be a DHCP client. You'll have to manually configure the DHCP UDP 67/68 packet filters.

HTH,
Tom

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 27
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 30.Jan.2004 10:11:00 AM   
tpagel

 

Posts: 3
Joined: 28.Jan.2004
Status: offline
Tom,

well, a normal packet filter will not help... I talked with MS PSS. They showed me how to setup a packet filter for the DHCP broadcast. You don't have to bind the filter to the NIC's IP address but to IP 0.0.0.0. So a packet filter for 67 local 68 remote in both directions did the trick...

They also told me that they might build a KB article for that...

Thomas

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 28
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 3.Feb.2004 4:19:00 PM   
Ceth Eslick

 

Posts: 8
Joined: 5.Jul.2001
Status: offline
I set up my system as Kirill suggested. However, my VPN clients are having trouble accessing certain subnets. My ISA server is directly connected to three subnets and the internet. Two of them are internal networks, and the third is a DMZ. Across the DMZ are 4 more subnets by way of building-to-building wireless bridges. Each building has its own router seperating the DMZ from their own internal LANs.

From the VPN clients, I can access the two subnets that are directly connected to the ISA server, but I can't access the subnets in the other buildings. Tracerts to those subnets go nowhere.

Any ideas?

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 29
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 3.Feb.2004 10:27:00 PM   
Todd G

 

Posts: 86
Joined: 27.Apr.2002
From: Peoria, AZ
Status: offline
I currently use ISA for my DHCP server. If I move my wireless clients to a DMZ, will I be able to use the ISA machine for DHCP?

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 30
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 4.Feb.2004 9:06:00 PM   
Kirill

 

Posts: 205
Joined: 26.Sep.2001
Status: offline
quote:
Originally posted by Ceth Eslick:
I set up my system as Kirill suggested. However, my VPN clients are having trouble accessing certain subnets. My ISA server is directly connected to three subnets and the internet. Two of them are internal networks, and the third is a DMZ. Across the DMZ are 4 more subnets by way of building-to-building wireless bridges. Each building has its own router seperating the DMZ from their own internal LANs.

From the VPN clients, I can access the two subnets that are directly connected to the ISA server, but I can't access the subnets in the other buildings. Tracerts to those subnets go nowhere.

Any ideas?

No surprises here. It works as planned. In my scenario DMZ is used for VPN traffic only, nothing else will pass through. As soon as a wireless client gets connected through VPN, it "jumps the subnets", providing a seamless operation on the network.
You will need something else for your configuration...

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 31
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 6.Feb.2004 11:26:00 AM   
Ceth Eslick

 

Posts: 8
Joined: 5.Jul.2001
Status: offline
quote:
Originally posted by Kirill:
In my scenario DMZ is used for VPN traffic only, nothing else will pass through. As soon as a wireless client gets connected through VPN, it "jumps the subnets", providing a seamless operation on the network.
You will need something else for your configuration...[/QB]

Internal, wired clients have no trouble reaching these subnets. Only the VPN clients are having problems. After ISA Server receives and decrypts VPN Client packets, shouldn't it forward them to their Non-VPN destinations regardless of whether the destination is on a local segment or on the other side of a router?

For example, this works:
VPN Client > ISA Server > Destination

But this doesn't:
VPN Client > ISA Server > Router > Destination

My hardware is WPA compliant, so it isn't a pressing urgency, but I'm still curious as to why this isn't working.

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 32
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 29.Mar.2004 3:47:00 PM   
renus

 

Posts: 14
Joined: 26.Mar.2002
From: Portugal
Status: offline
Hi,

Sorry to burst in the conversation but I have one newbie wireless question.

I have this structure:
Internal Network (internal segment)---ISA Server 2 NICS (Internal and External) on different segments(On DC Windows 2003)---Drytek Router with Wireless Access Point (external segment)---Internet

I can only make wireless clients work if I put them on the same segment as the external interface.

How can I make Wireless clients comunicate with the Internal Network ??

How can I make them pass through ISA Server and use all the rules that I already have ???

Do I always need to use VPN¦s ???

Thanks,

RenT Fernandes

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 33
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 18.May2004 1:51:00 AM   
Money Penney

 

Posts: 130
Joined: 18.Sep.2002
From: Melbourne
Status: offline
Is there anything stopping me from using a PCI Wireless card for the DMZ instead of an access point?

Anything from a security or networking perspective that I might not be able to do or that might work differently (ignoring range and location of the antenna, etc.).

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 34
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 18.May2004 2:58:00 AM   
tshinder

 

Posts: 47490
Joined: 10.Jan.2001
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:
Originally posted by tpagel:
Tom,

well, a normal packet filter will not help... I talked with MS PSS. They showed me how to setup a packet filter for the DHCP broadcast. You don't have to bind the filter to the NIC's IP address but to IP 0.0.0.0. So a packet filter for 67 local 68 remote in both directions did the trick...

They also told me that they might build a KB article for that...

Thomas

Hi Thomas,

Thanks! Although when I wrote that article I figured that the WAP would act as the DHCP server for the WLAN DMZ.

Thanks!
Tom

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 35
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 18.May2004 3:04:00 AM   
tshinder

 

Posts: 47490
Joined: 10.Jan.2001
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:
Originally posted by Todd G:
I currently use ISA for my DHCP server. If I move my wireless clients to a DMZ, will I be able to use the ISA machine for DHCP?

Hi Todd,

I recommend using the built in features in your WAP, rather than using the ISA firewall as your DHCP for that segment.

HTH,
Tom

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 36
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 18.May2004 3:05:00 AM   
tshinder

 

Posts: 47490
Joined: 10.Jan.2001
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:
Originally posted by Kirill:
quote:
Originally posted by Ceth Eslick:
I set up my system as Kirill suggested. However, my VPN clients are having trouble accessing certain subnets. My ISA server is directly connected to three subnets and the internet. Two of them are internal networks, and the third is a DMZ. Across the DMZ are 4 more subnets by way of building-to-building wireless bridges. Each building has its own router seperating the DMZ from their own internal LANs.

From the VPN clients, I can access the two subnets that are directly connected to the ISA server, but I can't access the subnets in the other buildings. Tracerts to those subnets go nowhere.

Any ideas?

No surprises here. It works as planned. In my scenario DMZ is used for VPN traffic only, nothing else will pass through. As soon as a wireless client gets connected through VPN, it "jumps the subnets", providing a seamless operation on the network.
You will need something else for your configuration...

Hi Kirill,

EXACTLY! This is how I use it with ISA 2004 too.

Thanks!
Tom

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 37
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 18.May2004 3:06:00 AM   
tshinder

 

Posts: 47490
Joined: 10.Jan.2001
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:
Originally posted by Ceth Eslick:
quote:
Originally posted by Kirill:
In my scenario DMZ is used for VPN traffic only, nothing else will pass through. As soon as a wireless client gets connected through VPN, it "jumps the subnets", providing a seamless operation on the network.
You will need something else for your configuration...

Internal, wired clients have no trouble reaching these subnets. Only the VPN clients are having problems. After ISA Server receives and decrypts VPN Client packets, shouldn't it forward them to their Non-VPN destinations regardless of whether the destination is on a local segment or on the other side of a router?

For example, this works:
VPN Client > ISA Server > Destination

But this doesn't:
VPN Client > ISA Server > Router > Destination

My hardware is WPA compliant, so it isn't a pressing urgency, but I'm still curious as to why this isn't working.[/QB]

Hi Ceth,

As long as there are routing table entries on the ISA firewall for each segment, and you did NOT enable split tunneling on the VPN clients, then it'll work fine.

HTH<
Tom

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 38
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 16.Jun.2004 6:34:00 PM   
Michael L

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 16.Jun.2004
Status: offline
quote:
Originally posted by Kirill:
Here is a little guide on what I did. I used TomÆs guide as an idea and did something different [Smile]

Objectives: All wireless clients are domain members and should have the same type of access as if they were connecting from the inside of the network.

Step 1: Installed Windows 2003 server with 3 NIC cards with the following IPs: x.x.x.1 (External), y.y.y.1 (Internal), z.z.z.1 (DMZ).
Step 2: Installed ISA and included the internal network y.y.y.y to the LAT. DMZ was NOT included to the LAT.
Step 3: Used a VPN wizard ôAllow VPN client connectionsö on ISA.
Step 4: Tweaking the filters the wizard had created: Disabled all L2TP filters (wanted to use PPTP only). In PPTP filters changed from ôDefault IP addressö to the ôUse ISA serverÆs external IP addressö to ôz.z.z.1ö (DMZ).
Step 5: Created a security group called ôWireless usersö and included the users I wanted to have wireless access to this group.
Step 6: RRAS tweaking: In RRAS changed the ôPortsö so only WAN miniport (PPTP) is configured for remote access. In server properties ôSecurityö tab ôAuthentication methodsö enabled only MS-CHAP v2. Now the most important part: IP tab: Static address pool û added the set of addresses that is part of the internal network y.y.y.y; ôAdapterö-selected the one I used for DMZ. Created a remote access policy called ôWireless accessö to grant security group ôWireless usersö remote access.
Step 7: Created a VPN connectoid on a client computer to connect to the IP z.z.z.1 (DMZ) and selected ôAutomatically use my Windows log on name and passwordö in ôSecurityö. Selected PPTP. Instructed the users to log on ôUsing dial-up connectionö and select ôVPNö.

Now what have I achieved by doing it? There is only one filter on the ISA that allows the traffic from the DMZ û PPTP. No other traffic is let through. As soon as the user logs on, he gets an IP that is part of the internal network, so everything looks like heÆs connected from the inside. Domain resources are available, firewall client and web proxy work also.
No other tweaking required.

I hope it helps [Cool]

I'm a newbie with ISA 2004 and had a few questions - I have a 2003 server with 3 nics and ISA 2004 installed. Could someone post instructions that are a bit more detailed on how to implement the configuration described above (and any details on the policy changes described in other replies)? Sorry for the ignorance but I'm still working to figure out ISA04.

Much thanks... [Smile]

[ June 16, 2004, 06:37 PM: Message edited by: Michael L ]

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 39
RE: Discussion for Using a Trihomed ISA/VPN Server to S... - 19.Jun.2004 12:59:00 AM   
tshinder

 

Posts: 47490
Joined: 10.Jan.2001
From: Texas
Status: offline
Hi Michael,

You bet!

I'll put this on my list for the next article. Its a great topic and a config I've already implemented in a number of locations.

Thanks!
Tom

(in reply to tshinder)
Post #: 40

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